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Editorial - Italian Conversations – Art in the Age of Berlusconi
We made this book at the invitation of the Nomas Foundation in Rome. It took about a year and a half before we got the financing sorted and could start planning our travelling residency. The funding is a mix of private and public money. This too is a reality this age, in which art and science are increasingly at the mercy of market forces, even in the Netherlands, considered by many to be an art-funding paradise: where money grows on trees and everyone agrees that art is important for society’s welfare. Well, things are changing faster than we could have imagined, even in the 10 months we’ve been working on this publication. Throughout Europe there are dramatic cutbacks in public spending, including culture, and nothing will be the same. Is the Italian situation soon to be our future? But there is one big difference: in Italy, at least you’ll always have Italy!
7 Partners in 7 cities, in 7 chapters
From January to May 2011, we travelled to the seven predetermined cities or territories, where our partners and knowledgeable guides provided hospitality, put a programme together and introduced us to the local art scene and the Italian art ‘system’ as a whole. The partners who participate in this project are highly regarded non-profit artist- and curator-run spaces, and are part of Nomas’ network.
In order to do this research in three months, we copied the model of the Grand Tour. Our method is usually a mix of ‘hanging out’ and ‘targeted research’, but requires much more time than was available. It’s been an experiment. In the old days of the Grand Tour the knowledgeable guides were called cicerones. The old term does not quite fit here, since the role of our partners goes far beyond that of a knowledgeable guide: they are active participants. The idea was to give shape to the chapters with their close collaboration. We also had another travel companion in the form of three books by Paul Ginsborg: A History of Contemporary Italy: Society and Politics, 1943-1988; Italy and its Discontents, 1980-2001; and Silvio Berlusconi, Television, Power and Patrimony, 2004.
The aim of our journey was not to expose ourselves to the famous cultural legacy of classical antiquity and the Italian Renaissance, but to explore – as artists and non-academic researchers – Italy’s contemporary artistic, social and political scene through active witnesses. We started in Rome and ended in Palermo, passing through Florence, Bologna, Lugo, Milan, Viganella, Turin, Rivoli, Lecce, Matera, Bari, Santa Maria di Leuca, Naples and Gibellina.
^Rob Hamelijnck & Nienke Terpsma, artists and editors
eMail interview by Gabriele Naia in 7 questions
Email interview by Gabriele Naia was conducted during our artist residency in Parc Saint Leger – center d’art contemporaine in Pougues les Eaux, France, in the summer of 2011. We decided on a format of 7 questions in 7 days, to make the interview focused and time based. This interview was first published on...
Q1, Monday, Jul 11
Gabriele Naia: During this week, I’d like to talk with you about your recent trip along Italy, where you visited Rome, Bologna, Milan, Turin, Lecce, Naples and Palermo, in order to formulate a possible conceptual and geographical map of Italian contemporary art scene. This ambitious research will become your next issue, presented at Nomas Foundation, Rome, on October 2011. But, to begin, let’s step back a while. I’d like you to talk a little about the Fucking Good Art project, about how it came out and why, about the specific forms you choose to transmit and put into action your researches. In other words, what is FGA?
Rob & Nienke: FGA stands for Fucking Good Art. F****** before the Good Art is an exclamation… meaning the magazine is on the look for it. Yes, it sounds a bit rude, but the intention is positive, and people tend to remember the name! Anyway we chose this name 7 years ago, and now we have to deal with it. It all started end of 2003 when we wanted to be more actively involved in the art scene in Rotterdam. Have our say. We wanted to influence the local cultural politics, and give attention to the many shows in independent spaces that were on display, but didn’t get any attention in the national media, never got reflected upon by newspapers, art magazines etc. FGA started as a zine for art critique by artists, by makers rather than leaving it only to the academics. We invited artists and curators to collaborate, and published in print; a A3 pink paper like Gazzetta dello Sport folded to A5, later also online. We printed 750 copies and distributed this locally and nationally, very informally, mostly by the contributors. We tried to make an issue every two months. The reception was really good. Then Fucking Good Art changed into a traveling editorial art project for research, functioning within different local realities.
Q2, Tuesday, Jul 12
GN: “Traveling editorial art project” is a nice formula to sum up what you currently do. Since 2004 you’ve been focusing and collecting specific issues on a lot of cities: München, Berlin, Dresden, Copenhagen, Riga, Basel, Zurich, São Paulo, Tbilisi. Finally, in early 2011, you approached Italy.
But, again, let’s go back a little, because you raised an interesting topic: art critique. It is rather proved that, today, the contemporary art scene is much more influenced and driven by curators and collectors than art critics or art historians. That doesn’t mean, of course, that art critique doesn’t exist anymore - it has just lost the very weight it could have 40 or 50 years ago.
Then what is, in your opinion, the role of a non academic art critique, and what can be its function in such a general panorama? Your operation, pursued by inviting artists and curators to collaborate on your website and printed issues, can be considered as a sort of meta-critique. How do you look at that?
R&N: If we remember well there was a crisis in art critique – and maybe there still is. We bought the little paperback What Happened to Art Criticism? by James Elkins. It is about the loss of criticism as a craft, and at the same time it became perhaps too specialized and professional. Nowadays critics have to write texts for catalogs for artists and galleries to earn enough money.
On our Grand Tour in Italy we noticed that in Italy there is a confusion between the curator and the critic. In the past the critic was perhaps closer to the historian or the philosopher. We had a meeting with the über curator and critic Achille Bonito Oliva in his house. He said that there is no distinction anymore, the critic and the curator became one, in his person, ABO. We also learned that Achille Bonito Oliva is the one who introduced “Il Systema”, with very well defined roles and functions. Concetto Pozzati mentioned how since the war the artist disappeared from the centre stage, and became specialized as a producer, where before they were also writers, contextualized their work and taught. We are inspired by non-academic writing, and we’re interested in the point of view of the maker.
Our translator Gerard Forde just lectured us about artists from the past that came back into the spotlight because younger artists rediscovered them and studied them, and started a dialogue with the work in their own practice. These lines in art history are interesting we think.
Maybe writing on art – lets not use art criticism – is just another place where making and thinking meet. So yes our position is a meta position because we try to say something on art writing itself. The latest issues of the magazine aren’t about shows or works or art though, the subject changed to the whole context and humus around the production of art.
Q3, Wednesday, Jul 13
GN: I know Elkins' book, but I didn't read it yet. Achille Bonito Oliva, as you notice, is probably the most representative figure to summarize this fusion between the critic with the curator. But it must be said that a very few curators actually have such a preparation - that's probably where comes out the con-fusion you mentioned: if, today, curators and critics are usually embodied into one figure, nevertheless lot of exhibitions seem to lack a solid theorical (and theoretical) ground.
But regarding what you call the "writing on art": although in italy sometimes seem to lack in-depht researches and analysis, there are a lot of good art magazines as well, especially between Rome and Milan. cura.magazine, Nero, Kaleidoscope, Mousse, Exibart, Arteecritica, Flash Art, the brand new Artribune: despite the common place, there is a very vital and active debate. What is your impression about that, also comparing to other situations you came through in other cities or countries?
R&N: And SucoAccido in Palermo. First your first question: Yesterday we were working on the conversation with Adrienne Drake, curator from Giuliani Foundation in Rome. We were talking about this loss of distinction between curator and critic. She found it very problematic, because a critic should be free to write critically when he or she finds it necessary. Goal should be to Bring Art Further. A curator should be an accomplice of the artists in that.
But you cannot look at this without looking at the profane reality of everyday; in Italy to make living you have to, as Roberto Pinto said, write an article for 200 euro, curate a show for a gallery 1000, give a lecture for 150. It’s like the artists; patch workers. It’s difficult to gain an independent position like that.
About all the magazines and free press in Italy, It is really remarkable that in Italy over a period of lets say 7 years so many good art magazines were initiated. Nero almost started at the same time we did, but they have another path. We understood that one of the reason these magazines were founded is because it is so difficult for curators to find a job, start making exhibitions, and these magazines function as a space for curators, more than for artists.
We’re totally impressed by all these magazines, and we tried to figure out how they manage to make it anyhow, let alone for free. In a way they make a very good use of the fact so many Italians in the arts travel and migrate, it gives them a very tight and wide international network and reach. They are super professional, take different stands, look cool and manage to stay “on the wave”.
What we find puzzling with all these magazines is that they print 20, 40, or 60.000 copies and distribute them for free all over Italy – some can also be found in other countries in Europe. The whole distribution looks like the distribution of advertisements, and off course the magazines are totally funded by advertisements. It is the logics of market, where only a huge overproduction makes you economically viable; it must be so expensive to print 20.000, but at the same time probably if you print a normal 2000 you cannot sell the advertisements. Each of these magazines deal with that reality differently. Nero plays with ads that are from a different world and esthetics—they’re smuggling subversive content into a larger field by packaging it into a contradicting popular aesthetics. Mousse we suspect cleverly curate their advertisements and show only the most renowned spaces, but we’re curious how it functions having to juggle between these roles. We once spoke with someone from a local newspaper, because we wanted to print one issue of Fucking Good Art inside that paper. The woman we had to negotiate with said something shocking and cynical, she said: “Our content is only an envelop for the advertisements”. So what if, as a free magazine, you have to deal with big fashion houses, galleries, museums, and what have you. I think they’re all totally courageous to go into that complicated field, and try use it to make something worthwhile, showing and introducing work and ideas to such a large audience. But who’s the Trojan horse, and who’s hiding inside it?
Q4, Thursday, Jul 14
GN: I agree with you. It’s a rather complex situation. Since, as you say, a lot of curators actually write for art magazines - and since curators can’t be completely impartial because of their “complaisant” attitude - there will difficultly be a free and uninterested critique. And the point you raise about the huge presence of advertisement is somehow part of the same problem, I guess, because, despite the more or less visual disturb, galleries and museums ads actually trigger other subtle dynamics of power. These questions take us to another interesting topic: no profit, independent or artist-run spaces, that usually seem to function on opposition to institutions and galleries. During your italian Grand Tour, did you meet interesting realities such like that and, if so, which ones? Of what kind do you think is the link between these independent or underground spaces and the more official context? Are there some connections, or they stand separated without communicating to each other?
R&N: We saw not so many really new models or totally exceptional artistic proposals from what we already know. But we saw many people who find some spaces and niches within the exciting structures to do interesting things, or to provide important things they felt were lacking. An example everyone agrees on is Careof, since 20 years the only archive of contemporary Italian art in Italy. And off course the magazines are a great example. Between the different cities and regions the situation differs a lot. In the south we saw people coming back after years in the north or abroad, introducing new views, and, very interesting, finding new free space for the arts. Where in the north the arts find refuge in empty industrial buildings, the south has a seasonal logic; tourism offers lots of empty spaces, but only for 10 month a year. Some of them also gain independence from the Italian reality by applying for European money. In Sicily and Lespedeza there are independent initiatives that make a point of reconnecting the intellectual discourse to reality and needs of daily life. In Turin the fact that the city wants to brand itself as the Italian capital of contemporary arts gives some more space to artists and initiatives. Rome is in an exited mood welcoming many new spaces and finding a new solidarity. Then there are the private academies that are interesting and also kind of problematic.
In Germany they speak of ‘Off’ spaces, like a switch you can be “on” or “off” in art. Ludicrous to desire to be “off”. But what would be a better name? Non-profit, no-budget, independent art space, NGO, etc. These negative definitions interestingly show what is considered the most important power structure. In Georgia, after so many years of communism, everyone calls themselves “Non Governmental Organisation”, in our reality “Non Profit” shows the power of the market. In Turin we met people who thought “independent space” was ridiculous and pretentious, where in GB and the Netherlands this is perfectly normal to say. (Even with a grant from the government!) In Holland in the beginning of the 1980s we called ourselves artist-initiative. This evolved into artist-run and much later in 1990s of course we saw the first curator-run spaces. ‘Project Space’ is quite neutral, just saying what it does, although seeing art as a succession of ‘projects’ is not neutral at all. The notion that an artist-initiative could also be called non-profit artist-run space came from New York, and has in fact a more economical connotation.
How radical is it to be a non-profit organisation? Bill Gates Foundation is a non-profit organisation with an endowment of US$33.5 billion. Non-profit means you have tax profits etc. For Gates it is green washing. He feels bad and wants to the people he exploited to love him. A non-profit or not-for-profit organisation is an organisation that does not distribute its surplus funds to owners or shareholders, but instead uses them to do good. So it is very complicated. That’s why I prefer still project space or self-organised space for contemporary art. But basically what we are talking about is commercial or non-commercial, or lets say ideological. I think. In Berlin alone there are more than 60 project spaces – to compare, there are about 350 commercial galleries of which maybe only 20 are important powerful galleries. So what is the status of the other 330? Someone starting a gallery is also independent and auto-financed. Salon Populaire by Ellen Blumenstein and others in Berlin call their space a no-budget, because they simply have no money, and sell some beer and put their own money. Like 1:1projects did in Rome. The question is: what do you want? Do you want to contribute to the system, to Art, or do you use the highway.
It is clear however that it’s difficult to make time to run a space in a precarious reality in which “everyone for himself” is widely promoted. The new budget cuts in Italy as well as in the Netherlands will also have many consequences. If we don’t watch out, there will only be a few Bill Gates, Trusardi’s and Prada’s who can call themselves independent!
Outside of the arts there are also developments that are interesting and that the arts field could learn from; the slow food movement, and GAZ for instance, a new distribution network for ecological food from small producers. It’s connecting the small independent farmers who have some ideals about food production and landscape.
Q5, Friday, Jul 15
GN: I see. Your overview about the independent art scene is interesting, and actually spots out many tricky questions. However, it makes me a bit bewildered the fact you didn’t find any notable reality [nt1] during your Grand Tour. Since these spaces should be the very creative and experimental ground, to have a flat situation such like that means to have a very few energy for renewal. Isn’t it?
All the matter makes me wondering this: could the education system be part of the problem? Italian academies and art schools are quite old-style. Often they are not able to push students in the very core of the art scene, mainly because they don’t have concrete connections with the galleries or institutional circuit, but probably also because teaching methods actually don’t give a good preparation - able to put the students in a competitive position. Perhaps what I’m saying is a bit generic, nevertheless I think it is rather indicative that, in a recent interview, Hans Haacke stated that he didn’t know any remarkable italian art school, apart from Venice IUAV directed by Angela Vettese. What do you think about that? Have you been able to get an opinion about the topic?
R&N: Unfortunately we didn’t have a real impression from the academies. We wanted to, but perhaps it’s symptomatic nobody was very eager to take us, or are connected to people involved in the academies. The contemporary art scene and the academies are separate worlds. But there are exceptions off course. Nomas collaborations between visiting artists and the academy for instance, and we did speak with Alberto Garutti, who, we understood, is very important for the students of Brera. Then Venice, Bergamot, there is Naba for the rich kids, the summer academies Ratti and Spinola Banna are interesting initiatives, and about the academy in Sicily we also heard good stories. By the way; in Riso we saw the only very interesting group show of local artists, and I don’t know, but it could say something about the academy.
Jonathan Meese said we should close all art academies. It is a crazy idea. But there is also a truth in it. The art world is saturated with artists and curators. What will become of all these artists if we know that only 5 per cent will benefit from the system? I don’t want to sound too cynical, but this is a reality. In our Swiss Issue we looked for other models how to continue with art in this fucked up world. And in fact in our Italian issue which probably will bare the title ‘Italian Conversations – Art in Times of Berlusconi’ we continue to look for different proposals, more ecological models. This means: it is not about big profits, super stars, and power galleries, but how can you make art and contribute to an interesting cultural and intellectual climate. Art and art education, and even government funding education all start to adapt the same market thinking and strategies. How can we make resistance? Who will make resistance? In Holland we have quite good art education. At least some of the art academies have a good reputation. Rietveld academy is the most international. But now with the budget cuts our minister of culture decided to stop the funding of post graduate research institutes like Rijksacademie and Jan van Eyck.
Of course we know a few spaces that have an interesting proposal, or have a strong position in the Italian art scene. And specially many many individuals have. But we are reluctant to name them here and single them out. In our Italian issue there will be all the names of places and people we met and find exciting. So I guess you have to wait until our Italian Issue will be presented in Rome.
Q6, Saturday, Jul 17
GN: Absolutely. As a matter of fact I'm rather trying to catch feelings and impressions, than specific names of people or places. That's why I'd like to ask you what's the flavour and the mood you finally breathed during your Italian Gran Tour... Which were your expectations, and which have been your conclusions - providing that there can be any?
R&N: We hoped to meet people in Italy – from the art world - who have a less affirmative way of thinking. Who dare to think outside the art market and Darwinist competition. We believe in alternative networks. Because the (art) system that exists at the moment is good for few, and destructive for many. There is an economical crisis. And this crisis is there because of speculation and people having huge profits, while others end up with nothing. Read the book Hype! Kunst und Markt from Piroschka Dossi. This concentration on competition and the winners pinpoint a development: the escalation of inequality in our society. As an Italian you know about this. Right? Berlusconi has millions of euros, TV channels and real estate, while others have little. The art world is a mirror copy of this.
Ok, back to your question. But we also realized that so many people left the country and went to Berlin, Rotterdam, or New York. Like the artists from Transavanguardia. There is a brain drain. But we have also met a lot of people who came back to Italy because they think they need to be there to set up a structure and make some resistance. And finally; Italy is one of the most beautifull countries in the world. There is this wonderful daily material culture, it is one of the only countries where the supermarkets didn’t conquer everything and there are still small alimentary shops, great food and an incredible food culture, even in the inner cities; the landscape, the proximity of heritage and beauty of many centuries every step you take, outdoor life and always something happens in the streets, there are still a lot of small industries and crafts, and in cities like Palermo an incredible mix and inner cities that aren’t gentrified, elegance everywhere… Things have to be quite bad to leave Italy! The other day we were talking about the 50% budget cuts in the contemporary art funding and the severe cuts in education and public TV in the Netherlands, and how much this starts to look like the Italian situation. We were silent and sad, and then Rob said; ok, but when it all collapses, in Italy at least you always have Italy!
Q7, Sunday, Jul 17
GN: Perhaps it’s a matter of artists’ aim: I often have the feeling that, today, for many artists the very aim is to be part of the system, rather than to push on its boundaries or to push, as you say, Art further. And I don’t think that this is just an Italian problem...
R&N: However, on next October the brand new Italian issue will be presented at Nomas Foundation, and there we will find everything about this exciting experience you had during these months. Just one more, this time silly, question: since you’re interested in alternative networks, underground realities and resistance, why did you choose the Gazzetta dello Sport-pink tone for Fucking Good Art? After all, Gazzetta dello Sport is one of the most popular Italian magazines, the very contrary of your militant spirit... (Laughing)… yes, radical content is best read through a pair of pink glasses. We take ourselves seriously, and the pink paper makes it a bit friendlier, makes it funny and therefore better to digest. The real story behind this color is that Nienke had some paper left from a card she printed for her sisters baby. So the first issue we used the pink paper that was left and it became the identity of Fucking Good Art.
GN: This sounds much more FGA!
Note1: we answered the question before differently.
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Italian Conversations – Art in the age of Berlusconi
Editors: Rob Hamelijnck & Nienke Terpsma
Design: Nienke Terpsma
Size: 21 x 29,7 cm; soft cover
Pages: 240; 32 pages color
Language: English
Co-published with post editions, Rotterdam, and NERO, Rome.
Order online:
Or order online at:
www.post-editions.com
www.neromagazine.it
Now available in bookshops across Europe, UK, America, and online. We offer a safe way to pay through PayPal. Delivered in Holland for free.
This issue is co-published with post editions, Rotterdam, and NERO, Rome.
After 7 years our trusty design has slightly changed, and the size is A4 instead of A5.
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Reviews
www.huffingtonpost.com
www.metropolism.com
7 Partners / Ciceroni
Nomas Foundation, Rome
Cecilia Canziani & Ilaria Gianni
Nosadella.due,Bologna
Elisa Del Prete
Careof, Milan
Chiara Agnello
Progetto Diogene, Turin
Raffaella Spagna & Andrea Caretto
Archiviazioni, Lecce
Giusy Checola & Luigi Presicce
Morra Greco, Napels
Francesca Boenzi
FPAC gallery, Palermo
Francesco Pantaleone
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Supporters
Nomas Foundation, Rome
Fonds BKVB, Amsterdam
Mondriaan Foundation, Amsterdam
Embassy of the Kingdom of the Netehrlands, Rome
Centre d'Art Contemporaine Parc Saint Leger, Pougues les Eaux
Colour & Books, Apeldoorn
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Colophon
Fucking Good Art HQ – Rotterdam / Berlin
Editors – Rob Hamelijnck and Nienke Terpsma
Webdesign – catalogtree.net
Webmaster – Guy Lux
First issue December 2003
Email – mail[at]fuckinggoodart.nl
Fucking Good Art is an editorial project for research in art. We are interested in ethnography and oral history, documentary and aesthetic journalism, counter cultures and sub cultures, Civil Society, self-organisation and DIY (do-it-yourself) strategies, art and activism, resistance, models 'outside' the art market, and ecological art practises. We have a participatory strategy and are by nature highly sensitive to the context we are in.
Special editions (in other European cities):
2004 - München edition (A3)
2005 - The Interviews (pocket book)
2006 - International edition/Berlin (pocket book)
2006 - Dresden edition (A3)
2007 - Kopenhagen edition (booklet)
2007 - Riga (web-radio edition)
2008 - The Swiss Issue (pocket book)
2009 - Portscape ON_AIR (web-radio edition)
2010 - Tbilisi – Caucasus Reader (online)
2012 - The Italian Conversations – Art in the Age of Berlusconi (book)
Out in February.
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